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Post Info TOPIC: Deeper into dictatorship


Profuse Pontificator

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Deeper into dictatorship


http://www.newswithviews.com/baldwin/baldwin524.htm

"As some of you may know, several states have and are passing legislation regarding the independence and sovereignty of the people of their respective states. More specifically, the states of Tennessee and Montana have passed "Firearms Freedom Acts," which have become law and which reaffirm their Sovereignty under the 10th Amendment of the US Constitution. This law states that any firearms that are made, sold and bought in that state are NOT subject to the Federal regulations of firearms, because they are inherently internal affairs, which exempt them from the commerce clause of the US Constitution.

"As you would imagine, the Federal government, through its agency, the Department of Justice, did not take too kindly to Tennessee's assertion of jurisdiction over this matter and position that the federal laws did not apply to the subject matter at hand. This federal opposition has become known through the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives (ATF), whereby they informed the firearms licensees in an "open letter" in Tennessee that the recently enacted law (Firearms Freedom Act) does not apply and is void and that they (the firearms licensees) must still obey and submit to the federal laws, regardless of the State's statute.

"This ATF response tells us the following about the federal government's ideology of Sovereignty: (1) the federal government does not recognize the lawful and independent jurisdiction of the Sovereigns of Tennessee to operate their internal affairs as they deem proper and fitting; (2) the Sovereigns of Tennessee do not possess lawful jurisdiction to govern themselves through constitutional means; (3) the federal government has the power and authority to control the internal affairs of all States, as they deem fit. Bottom line, the Federal government is Sovereign. With their theory in mind, however, what commodity, what relationship, what contract, what service, or what molecule in this entire country would not be subject to their control and power?"

"However, the Federal government today does not recognize the Sovereignty in the people of the respective states; it does not recognize the respective States' jurisdiction over all matters not expressly delegated to the federal government; and it does not seem to acknowledge State Sovereignty under the 10th amendment of the US Constitution. Given their evident intent and purposes to continually grow in power and to continually oppress and suppress the sovereignty of we the people, against our respective states, the question becomes, how will they be made to understand this? It is of course up to the Sovereigns in each state to answer this question."

So how does this further weakening of the US Constitution effect us?  Why should we even care about this further weakening of the US Constitution?  At the July 2 Freedom Festival in Provo, UT, President Boyd Packer stated  "And now we face a danger greater than any of the wars we have faced.  To honor the Constitution and to honor freedom is a sacred duty for all of us." 



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Jen


Senior Bucketkeeper

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I'm sorry but I think that this kind of hyperbole is at least part of why the forum has declined in participation. Speaking for myself, anyway, it certainly is.

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"There is order in the way the Lord reveals His will to mankind. . .we cannot receive revelation for someone else's stewardship." L. Tom Perry


Profuse Pontificator

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The above article I posted concerns just one example of the United States government's refusal to recognize neither the sovereignty in the people of the respective states, nor of the respective states' jurisdiction over all matters not expressly delegated to the federal government, nor states' sovereignty under the 10th Amendment of the US Constitution.  It is no exaggeration.  We are looking at another example in this country of flagrant violation of the US Constitution.  That we should do what we can as individuals to oppose such is made clear in the Doctrine and Covenents, as well as in President Packer's 2 July 2009 sstatement that "...now we face a danger greater than any of the wars we have faced.  To honor the Constitution and to honor freedom is a sacred duty for all of us." But why should we LDSs even concern ourselves with upholding and abiding by our Constitution, when that late nite talk show host Jay Leno would suggest that we give our Constitution to Iraq, since we don't use ours any more.  

"We the people" are expected to play by the rules, in short, to abide by the law.  If we dont, we may find ourselves fined or even jailed.  Our federal government is also expected to abide by rules in its case, the Constitution of the United States.  The Constitution specifies which powers the federal government may exercise, and forbids any others.  The Tenth Amendment to the Constitution is explicit: The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

Granted, state sovereignty has been largely negated, and federal power has grown exponentially.  Creation of the Federal Reserve; the fighting of undeclared wars; Social Security; the building of massive bureaucracies that regulate food, drugs, the environment, energy, etc.; the nationwide enforcement of abortion and prohibition of school prayer; the issuing of presidential directives these are just a few examples of how the federal government has overstepped its bounds, assuming powers not permitted by the Constitution.

However, this new campaign called the Tenth Amendment Movement is now in at least 36 state legislatures.  A spark plug for the movement has been outrage over the federal governments $700 billion bailout of the financial industry and $17 billion bailout of the auto industry.

This is not an effort by the states to secede from the Union, but an attempt to persuade the federal government to abide by the Constitution. 
So many of the problems our country faces would be resolved if the federal government was restricted to its constitutional powers.

The efforts of the states to reassert their constitutional authority did not begin with the Tenth Amendment Movement. There had already been widespread opposition to the Real ID Act, with 20 states passing resolutions opposing its implementation.  One might comoplain that the Tenth Amendment resolutions are only expressions of opinion with no real teeth i.e., they do not specifically repeal or block unconstitutional federal laws.  The issue currently raging in Montana and Tenneesee seems to be moving toward more action to match the talk - I hope.



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Head Chef

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Jen wrote:

I'm sorry but I think that this kind of hyperbole is at least part of why the forum has declined in participation. Speaking for myself, anyway, it certainly is.




Jen, I have no doubt that that is the reason why some don't post anymore. But some of the most regular posters have switched to a forum that has more "gloom and doom" than this forum did in its heyday. So I don't think that that's the primary reason for the decline.

That being said, if you want to see other kinds of content as well, suggest some stuff. I'll try to get the ball rolling and post some stuff like that. Also, what did you most enjoy about this forum, and what do you come back hoping to see? We can try to get that going again.

Participation on almost all forums I read is down.



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If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!
- Samuel Adams


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Obama is hiding something. When I am at work and somebody does this they are covering something up. Did Obama claim foreign citizenship while in school, was he born in Kenya, did he lie about one or both during school, did he tell the truth on the school info? I don't know. I do know that if you spend millions of dollars to hide your records you are covering something up. This quote is the crux of the issue for me: Defusing the issue would be easy: Obama could simply provide a legitimate and complete birth certificate proving his birth location. Not only has he stubbornly refused to do so, but he has spent several million dollars in legal fees to thwart various citizen lawsuits that demand proper disclosure.




http://www.augustforecast.com/2009/07/24/constitutional-crisis-looming/


Constitutional crisis looming?

By Patrick Wood, Editor

The inflammatory issue of Barrack Obamas birth certificate is gathering steam across America: Was he or was he not born in the United States?

If he was born anywhere other than on American soil, then his presidency is invalidated. Why? The Constitution of the United States pointedly requires that the President be a natural born citizen.

Defusing the issue would be easy: Obama could simply provide a legitimate and complete birth certificate proving his birth location. Not only has he stubbornly refused to do so, but he has spent several million dollars in legal fees to thwart various citizen lawsuits that demand proper disclosure.

Obama has also legally cloaked records that could potentially support or discredit his citizenship claims, like school records and transcripts from Harvard and Occidental College. Some investigators suspect that he may have applied for admission as a foreign student.

The pack of critics (called birthers by Obama defenders) is getting larger by the day. Lou Dobbs and Rush Limbaugh are both talking about it. WorldNet Daily devoted an entire issue of WhistleBlower Magazine to it. Lawyers have filed dozens of lawsuits. Military officers are challenging potentially illegal orders to be deployed to combat zones overseas. Left-wing organizations are being drawn into vocal opposition, thus stirring the pot even more.

As the battle heats up, the attacks on the birthers by their detractors (mostly left-wing) is taking on a familiar pattern. The former are being being ruthlessly ridiculed, scorned and marginalized as the lunatic fringe.

So far, neither side has blinked. Neither is willing to give an inch. The battle lines have been drawn.

Herein lies the problem.

Barrack Obamas approval rating is already dropping like a rock and the public is more sharply polarized than ever.

After just six months in office, Obama has fared worse than even Jimmy Carter in 1976, whose outrageous acts had enraged the American public like none before him. Carter had no chance of serving a second term.

Many Democrats have already pulled away from Obama, fearing that he is a) too far to the left or b) pursuing a narcissistic agenda that leaves them out of the picture.

Obama should have balked during his campaign when supporters and his captive media compared him to the Messiah. Everybody hailed Jesus Christ when he appeared in Jerusalem on Palm Sunday, but less than three days later, they demanded his execution.

Perhaps Obama was convinced by his handlers that nobody would care about this natural born citizen thing. Or, perhaps they convinced him that he could get away with it even if they did care.

What Obama may not know is that these same handlers might soon offer him up as a cheap sacrifice in order to force a Constitutional crisis.

Why? Because it would almost certainly require a Constitutional Convention to straighten out the mess. Every Presidential act would be invalidated. Civil unrest would be rampant. Chaos would reign, and chaos is the desired environment for the powers behind Obama.

With every passing day that the birth issue is not resolved in Obamas favor, the odds will persistently increase that a Constitutional crisis will soon unfold, and that America will be polarized like never before in history.
With every passing day that the birth issue is not resolved in Obamas favor, the odds will per­sis­tently increase that a Con­sti­tu­tional crisis will soon unfold, and that America will be polar­ized like never before in history.

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Obama did issue a copy of his birth certificate to the press.

But no. "It's a forgery! There is no seal on it!"

Those who examine it say "yes there is a seal, it is on the back and it just doesn't show up on the photocopy."

But no. "You're lying! Besides it doesn't look like other birth certificates!"

Hawaii department of records issues a statement: "Birth certificates often looked different from each other in 1961. We have examined the records and they are official. He was born here in Hawaii."

But no. "You're lying!. Besides there is no hospital listed on the certificate."

Hawaii department of records issues statement: "Hospitals often don't appear on birth certificates in those early years."

But no; "You're lying! Where is a second confirmation?"

Birth announcements are found in both the newspapers of the day announcing his birth, date, and parents.'

But no. "They are forgeries! Anyone can print anything in newspapers."

Woman comes forward who remembers his birth and reveals the hospital where he was born.

But no. "She's lying! Release his birth certificate!"

Hawaii department of records again issues a statement: "We have examined the records again and they are official. He was born here in 1961, 2 years after Hawaii became a state."

But no. "You continue to lie! Release all his school records!"

Obama is sued. Judge throws out the law suit as frivolous and having no merit.

But no. "The judge is a Republican stooge! Impeach the Judge!"

Congress issues statement congratulating Hawaii on their 50 year anniversary of becoming a state and adds: "Birth place of Obama!"

But no: "Congress is just in his back pocket. They would say he was born on the moon if it were helpful."

He was born in Hawaii. Hawaii was a state. He is a citizen. The longer the right wing tries to make an issue of it, the sillier they look.

And a "continental congress" could not straighten out the mess. A continental congress can only make changes to the constitution. They cannot undo laws that have been made. The ones that have the best chance to "straighten out any mess" is the new congress elected in 2010.

Time to get over this issue and move on to something else.



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"The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter."   -Winston Churchill




Profuse Pontificator

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As Mirkwood and others have pointed out, Obama could simply provide a legitimate and complete birth certificate proving his birth location. Not only has he stubbornly refused to do so, but he has spent several million dollars in legal fees to thwart various citizen lawsuits that demand proper disclosure.  But there are far worse things about him that we should be more concerned about for now, and Obama's place of birth issue is a distraction from his abortion beliefs, his Marxist and unconstitutional concept of redistribution of wealth, his view that America is not a Christian nation, his view of amnesty and welfare for persons in the USA illegally, his view on homosexual practices, his definition of marriage, his view on national healthcare, his contempt for the US Constitution, and his contempt for America, among other things.

The issue of Obama's elligibility to be US President serves as a partial smoke screen  for the above far more serious issues, just as Monicagate provided President Clinton with a very effective smoke screen for Chinagate. 

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