So, what think ye of the California Supreme Court's legislating from the bench? This may seem like hyperbole to many, but I think that now that California has legalized the fiction of gay marriage, that now many other states will follow suit. We'll start seeing suits in many states demanding equal treatment. We're protected in Colorado from the current line of assault, as are many other states, because it is enshrined in our state constitution. But I'm sure that they will find a way to attack that as well. As the family falls, society will decline. Society is based on the family, and an attack on the family weakens society.
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If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen! - Samuel Adams
Surprisingly, I think that we may still have a long way to fall before the sword of justice falls. As appalling as this ruling is, and as horrible as it is, this is just the beginning of the disintegration of the family in our civilization.
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If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen! - Samuel Adams
arbi, I don't think it's the beginning of the disintegration of the family. Our families have been attacked, and successfully so, for years. Just think of teen pregnancies, fathers out of the home, mothers working/seeking "fulfillment" away from families, etc. I think this is another example of Satan's work and something that is more visible.
There's an interesting discussion going on on another forum regarding same-sex marriage and how it destroys society--without using LDS doctrine as "proof." This forum has members and non-members. Some people are talking about allowing homosexual marriages destroy society. Some are asking for true examples of how that destroys society--they point to foreign countries where it is allowed as examples.
Anyway, I thought it interesting because on the surface it sounds "right"--why shouldn't everyone be equal and have the same privleges/rights as others? There's no evidence that allowing these marriages are a destructive force to society. Yet, that is the craftiness and sublety of one who has honed his craft over millenia. Satan mimicks good and true doctrine so insidisously that he blinds and convinces others of "proof."
And I wouldn't be able to keep the doctrine out of the discussion. That is the joy and safety net we have--modern revelation and true paths revealed from on High. I may not be as eloquent in explaining or providing "proof", but for myself I don't need it. God said it, so that's good enough for me.
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It takes a big man to cry, but it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man.
I think in a nutshell too, it leads you down the path of "Who's to say" what's right or wrong, there is no Standard of Truth, what's True for you might not be True for the next guy... eliminates the role of God as what we are trying to follow and believe in.
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Life is tough but it's tougher if you're stupid. -John Wayne
The fact that 4 out of 7 judges can overturn all of the laws and statutes the people have passed angers me.
This art of twisting constitutions to whatever you want them to say, has in effect given judges absolute control over this country. We only have a represenative government when the courts don't intervene.
In the last worldwide training, elder Holland said something that settled it all for me. To paraphrase, he said that just because there are many people who are not able to, for whatever reason, achieve the ideal family, we should not stop teaching the ideal. To do so is to abandon the standard that serves as our anchor. I'm sure I bungled that one good, but I hope the idea gets across.
The idea of drawing a line and holding to that standard is unpopular today. Slippery slope or whatever you want to call it - if marriage ceases to mean one man and one woman, what does it define? Where do you stop with the boundary of who can marry? At least until CA gets an amendment passed, marriage now includes same sex couples. Why stop there? Let's make polygamy legal too, and while we're at it, forget any age requirements. While we're at it, why don't we relax the restrictions on sexual relationships between family members too - why should the biological circumstance of being siblings prohibit a couple from having personal fulfillment together? (yes, I know there are genetic risks... but babies can be prevented or aborted in that case) What if I really love my dog -- are you going to deny me the rights of happiness and legal protection by preventing me from entering into marriage with my pet?
Scientific studies have proven that children do better in homes where there is a father and a mother. The fact that many hetero- marriages fail is irrelevant. That is still the standard that gives a child the best chance to grow up physically and emotionally healthy. But that's not important because personal rights and fulfillment are more important than children.
I think it's going to get a lot worse than this before the sword falls. You ain't seen nuttin' yet.
In the last worldwide training, elder Holland said something that settled it all for me. To paraphrase, he said that just because there are many people who are not able to, for whatever reason, achieve the ideal family, we should not stop teaching the ideal. To do so is to abandon the standard that serves as our anchor. I'm sure I bungled that one good, but I hope the idea gets across.
Thanks for the reminder from Elder Holland. That's why, as a single, I don't mind repeated talks on family, being a mother (except Mother's Day, but that's another discussion), being a good wife, etc. Yeah, I get tired of it--constant reminder of my singleness--but wow, am I prepared for a husband and family!
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It takes a big man to cry, but it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man.
Beef, I realize that the family has been under attack before. But this development is huge as an attack on the family. I heard someone say on the radio yesterday that after getting homosexuality accepted generally amongst the population, they'll attack heterosexuality. That is, that they won't be content to coexist, that homosexuals will want to make us second class citizens. Now, that's sounds pretty far fetched to me. But it doesn't mean that it can't happen. I remember when the states successfully sued the tobacco companies that someone predicted that they would go after fast food next for making people fat. I remember being very dismissive of the idea, that surely people had much more sense than that and it could never happen. But it did.
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If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen! - Samuel Adams
Since there was a litany list of reasons why the family is already distentegrating I thought I would add in the wide-spread physical and sexual abuse against women and children.
God can destroy a city or a nation in a single day. The people in Ammoniha didn't believe it, their city was too great, but it happened in a single day. Look at New Olreans, the tsunami, the Myanmar hurricane, the Chinese earthquake, the world trade center, and the MO/OK/AR tornados. It is happening today all over the world, even in the USA. There is nothing that is absolutely protecting us anymore. Sodom would have been spared for 5 righteous people, I wonder if we have enough?
Interesting how the Proclamation on the Family addresses this. I sort of thought of the Proclamation as sort of benign until I read the book " ---------- dang, can't think of the title now. He was a BYU professor and went to the UN something-or-other and defended the traditional family and stuff... talked about his experiences and how he used the Proclamation, etc... It's simple, but very powerful. And will become much more offensive as time goes on, I believe...
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Life is tough but it's tougher if you're stupid. -John Wayne
