Accepting the Standards of the Church

beefche · Profuse Pontificator

RE: Accepting the Standards of the Church

Jen · Senior Bucketkeeper

Hoss Cartwright wrote:

I took the gist of "Why the church is as true as the gospel" to be:

The church is like a refiner's fire, an organization which has imperfections which MUST exist to refine us into the people we need to be.

I'll toss this in of my own mind:

Life is like a lathe, and we are a big block of wood. The world spins us round and round, but the church (and the members thereof) are like the knife that cuts into our side, knocking off the rough edges, until we are left as a beautiful fruit bowl fit to take our place on the dining table in the Mansion of God.

That's really beautiful, Hoss.

Hoss Cartwright · Senior Member

Thank you.

The first time I took a knife to a block of wood on a lathe, I cut in too deep, and the wood came detached from the lathe and went flying across the room.

No one got hurt, but it left a lasting impression.

Cat Herder · Understander of unimportant things

but it left a lasting impression

In the wall?

Cool man!

Jen · Senior Bucketkeeper

There's a dent in my bedroom wall the size of a softball. My head put it there. Moral of the story: Don't use a barstool as a stepladder.

I know, I know. Explains a lot, doesn't it?

Cat Herder · Understander of unimportant things

Hmmm... about this for an analogy of the church and it's members helping to smooth our rough edges:

We are like stones in a rock polisher... over time, and from the turning and upheavel, we bump up against others and others bump up against us. Eventually, we wear each other's rough and jagged spots down. With the fine grit of gospel living and the polishing beads of repentance and forgiveness, those of us who stay put in the tumbling chamber of ward life will leave mortality a beautifully polished stone that radiates beauty to all who see.

LoudmouthMormon · Profuse Pontificator

Hoss Cartwright wrote:
Life is like a lathe, and we are a big block of wood. The world spins us round and round, but the church (and the members thereof) are like the knife that cuts into our side, knocking off the rough edges, until we are left as a beautiful fruit bowl fit to take our place on the dining table in the Mansion of God.

Hmm. I think I can take this and run with it. Except not all members are part of this refining process. Some of them just sit there and make dumb comments while the process is happening, or are bawling about wanting to use the wrong tool, or are all up in yer grill about how a candlestick is far more appropriate than a fruit bowl.

I suppose in some indirect way, they may help in the process. But I'm thinking not all people who are painful to be around are useful.

LM

Hoss Cartwright · Senior Member

Perhaps we should begin a thread about how those annoying members of the church can somehow make us shine like crazy diamonds.

Cocobeem · Keeper of the Holy Grail

I didn't know EE got reprimanded by Elder McConkie!

As for the concept that God is progressing vs. God is not progressing (in regard to knowlege) that's been debated since the Restoration. I believe Brigham Young believed he was progressing and Orson Pratt was on the other side, if I recall...

Here's the McConkie letter, if anyone's interested-- (McConkie attacks Brigham Young as much as anyone else.)

Short excerpt: "I do not know all of the providences of the Lord, but I do know that he permits false doctrine to be taught in and out of the Church and that such teaching is part of the sifting process of mortality. We will be judged by what we believe among other things. If we believe false doctrine, we will be condemned. If that belief is on basic and fundamental things, it will lead us astray and we will lose our souls." (pg. 7)

Entire letter - http://www.mrm.org/topics/documents-speeches/bruce-mcconkies-letter-rebuke-professor-eugene-england

If things are brought up I will occasionally provide a link so we do not rely on second-hand memories.

-- Edited by Cocobeem at 13:38, 2007-11-01

Jen · Senior Bucketkeeper

-- Edited by Jen at 13:56, 2007-11-01

Hoss Cartwright · Senior Member

I think what she is saying is that Elder McConkie got reprimanded for the first version of "Mormon Doctrine."

Actually, I think Elder McConkie showed great character by editing his book accordingly.

It just goes to show that being reprimanded (by an apostle or even a prophet) doesn't make one unworthy, if one makes the appropriate changes.

Hoss Cartwright · Senior Member

-- Edited by Hoss Cartwright at 21:13, 2007-11-01

Cocobeem · Keeper of the Holy Grail

Yep, that's what I was saying. It surprised me from what I know of Elder McConkie that he would be the one to do the reprimanding. No disrespect meant. I like the fact that Elder McConkie got out there and said what he thought.

Jen · Senior Bucketkeeper

Hoss Cartwright wrote:

Elder McConkie or England?

Yes.

zealia · Profuse Pontificator

Living the standards helps keep me out of trouble. :)

lundbaek · Profuse Pontificator

I think one of the standards of the Gospel is to keep the sabbath day holy, or in other words to refrain from certain activities like unnecesary work, parties, fishing and hunting, public entertainment, and sports, etc. How do you view athletes, both pro and amature, who participate in sports on the sabbath? How do you react when a church leader or authority calls attention to one such as a good representative of the Church and one to be looked up to?

PollyAnna · Senior Bucketkeeper

I try very hard not to project my personal adherence to any standard on others or even judge them by my views... because, well how they develop their own personal adherence to standards is between them and the Lord... Having said that...

"As for my and my house... we don't play sports (or anything like unto it) nor do we watch sports (course we have no TV signal into our home...) on the Sabbath..." Father's Epistle to the PollyClan 8:5

We have a whole bunch of those actually; (scripture specifically LIKENED to the PollyClan)...

rayb · Hot Air Balloon

That's a pretty good standard, Polly. I try to as well. I just wish it had more emphasis on my kids. They see some kids doing some things that they think have the same standards as we do, and well... it's like a giant battle.

--Ray

PollyAnna · Senior Bucketkeeper

Keep up the good fight ray... you'd be surprised what your kids are absorbing!!!

rayb · Hot Air Balloon

Right now the good fight involves a lot more yelling than I'd like.

PollyAnna · Senior Bucketkeeper

count more... longer.... works for me...

Hoss Cartwright · Senior Member

lundbaek wrote:
How do you react when a church leader or authority calls attention to one such as a good representative of the Church and one to be looked up to?

I react confusedly. aww

And I usually say something snarky and sarcastic about it. But I think we're all getting bored of me, so I won't do that now.

rayb · Hot Air Balloon

I'm not sick of you!

Cat Herder · Understander of unimportant things

We luv ya man!

Hoss Cartwright · Senior Member

Oh, you're both so good to me. smile

What I meant was: We are all (or maybe it's just me) bored with my constant carping about million dollar Mormon sabbath breakers. You know; I always hold forth on that, white shirts, and beards. yawn

rayb · Hot Air Balloon

Deacons, teachers and priests are all so oppressed, Hoss. You're fighting for their rights. I'm sure there's a little placard somewhere in heaven with your name engraved on it. :)

--Ray

Cat Herder · Understander of unimportant things

Oh that!

What about if they are million dollar Mormon sabbath breakers who have beards and wear white shirts?

{taking personal inventory... Hmmm. I currently sports a beard and will be for at least another month, wear white shirts on Sunday, ain't the best example of sabbath observance since I likes to nap all afternoon instead of doing HT'ing on Sundays, and definitely do not have a million dollar salary -- or anywhere near it! Whew! I'm still safe!}