arbilad wrote:

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My brother and his family live in Orange County, but so far they're safe.

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Thats good to hear.

 

These fires have nothing to do with global warming or Iraq. The fact is that there has been a huge growth of homes in areas that traditionally had been wilderness and many, many years of not cleaning up vegetation. Then we hit a drought year this year and the whole state is one giant tinder box. There literally isn't a place in this state that isn't ready to burn with a lightening strike or a firebug's help. It's nearly impossible to clear out any dead brush or trees without hiring a lawyer.

I want to know how many Walmarts have been looted, too...

You don't suppose the possibility of the firebug arsonists being terrorists?

I think I've heard that authorities have arrested one individual for attempted arson earlier this week.

There needs to be something done about disincenting people and developers from continuing to build / rebuild in these areas that are prone (by nature and by the stupid "green" laws in Nazifornia) to wild fires... the same way the government and insurers are finally starting to wise up and stop incenting people to build in flood plains that flood every year or so or along coastal areas that get devestated with every storm season by bailing them out.

I don't think that it's a result of building in fire prone areas. I think that it's a result of horrid forest management leading to fires of such enormous size that they reach farther than anyone had thought possible. They suppress all fires, large or small, so an enormous amount of dry undergrowth builds up. When it gets lit, it burns really hot and really fast, and it's very difficult to control. If they'd allow natural fires to happen, it would clear out the dry undergrowth before it became a problem. Live trees are actually pretty hard to burn, and a normal brush fire isn't hot enough to get them burning.
Logging companies allow brush fires to go their course, because they are interested in keeping the trees alive. You don't see fires like this beginning in land managed by logging companies.

Thank you Polly. You are quite right.

I'm not saying there should be no compassion. All I'm saying is that from a realistic standpoint, some wise community planning should take place to avoid this sort of problem in the future.

Most planning occurs based on the short term interests of developers, a city / community, and the prevailing winds from the eco-green agenda supporters.

I've heard reports that communities that were allowed to clear away under growth and brush and dead trees and other stuff away from the homes and properties actually got bypassed or suffered only nominal damage, whereas others where the zoning and eco-laws prevented that sort of wise land management are the ones where whole neighborhoods have burned to the ground.

And once that sort of realistic stuff is in place, why should the rest of the state / nation be expected to bail people out [i[who keep on rebuilding their million dollar homes in a righ risk area for land / mud slides, forest fire, or catatrophic flood? Let them bear the insurance risk, instead of the federal and state governments. Everyone else gets to pay for it doubly, in the form of taxes and increased homeowners insurance (even though the insurance companies deny it, it gets figured in with all the underwriting). Tornados and atmospheric storms can't be compared to these due to unpredictibility.

Reminds me of the T-shirt I used to have. It showed a British Soldier getting set to impale a colonial on his boyonette. It read, "We're from the government and we're here to help!"

This whole state is like a giant box of matches in a Boyscout's pocket. It is going to burn, we just don't know when the latest fire is going to pop up. Part of our farm is up in the hills where we have some beef cows. When I was a kid we would do controled burns to get rid of the brush and dead wood. Well the enviros and government regulation made it so difficult that we stopped. It has been over 25 years since anything has been done to clean up the dead brush, undergrowth and dead trees. The canyons are choked with a really nasty type of brush that has a huge wax content. When it goes it will be like burning newspaper soaked in gasoline. All it will take is a lightening strike and poof, this same situation the state is experiencing now will happen again though this time it will be in the central part of the state. The fact is that the forest service and the state have mismanaged the wooded areas so bad that there is no way to stop it if it does decide to go. No controlled burns, prohibiting removal of dead and diseased trees, prohibiting removal of pine needles, all under pressure from enviro groups. Then when the fire starts they complain that we should let the fires just burn.

We had a tree that was dieing. It was obvious it wasn't going to make it. But we could not remove it until someone came out and certified that it was completely and utterly dead. Huh? If there was one green leaf on it then it would not be able to be removed. In some areas of the state even removeal of the dead tree is prohibited. So people end up basically having to build homes in BBQ pits. The naysayser say they shouldn't build in those areas but frankly, the whole state is pretty much in the same position excluding a few areas near the Mojave desert. I know a guy who cannot get insurance on his home. The insurance agents come out, look at the surrounding hills and brush from 25 years of unfettered growth and reject his homeowners insurance. His family has lived on the same ranch in the same houses since the mid 19th century. A friend of his works for the forest service and is trying to help him get a permit to actually burn the brush back. Even with the help of a friend in the forest service, he estimates it will take three years minimum to get all the paperwork approved.

What is going to be especially fun to look forward to is the next heavy rains we get in these areas where there have been fires. When that waxy brush burns the wax melts onto the dirt and coats it so it won't stick together well anymore. Then the rains come and whole mountainsides start sliding down and destroying homes and roads because the dirt bits are coated in wax so they have nothing to grab to.

Will it ever change? Nope. They won't even build any water storage here even though the state population has exploded and a couple good drought years will mean no water coming out of the tap. They're from the government and they're here to help, that means they'll make sure the bayonette is sterilized before they poke it into your chest.

I don't know what I'm talking about, only what I heard and you are the one that lives on a farm, so...
The other day I was listening to a radio show and they were talking about this situation.  A man from OR called and said that they manage the dead growth with goats.  He said they eat everything and were able to clear up the problems - legally.  He even knew someone that rented out goats to do this for people.
Just think, clean yard and cheese to boot!

In our neck of the neighborhood, people are encouraged to keep the brush and trees 30 feet from your homes.  Some ignore the advice.

-- Edited by palmon at 16:22, 2007-10-27