The Doctrine and Covenants states that we cannot enjoy the Spiritual benefits of the City of Enoch until we've all become "equal" in temporal things... it's made me really think about stuff like this.

Could I help you bring that goal to pass Coco...??? I have a few extra medical bills you can have...

In all seriousness, I am not a good person when it comes to this kind of giving... I give... But I am a lazy giver... I let the church disperse it for me... I am good about being a part of our stake humanitarian happening... We get together a couple times a year and put together hygiene kits and I make blankets that I donate, but again the collection happens through my stake... But I don't do much personal outreach, anymore. We did more when the kids were little... I have just gotten lazy about my efforts... Fortunately my kids have continued to do a lot of personal outreach though the Stake YM/YW and YSA programs... They all do lots of great service project that help those that need help...

Each day a number of panhandlers are on the sidewalks around Temple Square.  The Church (I believe the Missionary Dept.) provides to missionaries who frequent the area a pamphlet explaining that most of those beggars are there regularly and that we should not encourage their activity by giving to them.    

I believe giving to organizations that help the poor is a better route often than giving to the poor directly. They are frequently poor/destitute for a reason - poor decisions and choices and they are going to continue to make those bad choices unless they get help to pull them out of the pit they have often dug themselves by changing their behavior. I'm not saying you shouldn't give handouts but I prefer actual food, clothing and etc. is better because they most likely will not squander such things.

The panhandlers outside of Temple Square who beg do so because it is easy. Going out and getting a job and trying to lift oneself up is not. Some of those panhandlers probably make a better living off of begging than I do from my job.

perpetual education fund?

Well, in limited areas the Church provides employment on farms, ranches, canneries, thrift stores (DI) and etc.  Employment assistance is available in many places.  The Church has also encouraged donations to other organizations that provide assistance in the area you live in.

A bishop is supposed to be discerning regarding the dispersement of fast offering funds.  Efforts of the one requesting assistance to improve their situation through their best efforts can be one of those things considered (and often is, from what I have observed).

I avoid panhandlers, cause I know first hand what a horrible abuse of generosity, that cycle can be... We knew of two people that use to do this, and neither was destitute...

Coco... If you seriously want to start your own scholarship fund... do it... I would encourage you to make this an EXTRA thing though... I it my opinion that we should not tell the Lord how to take care of his children... that leads many people down a long road of sorrow... The church does just fine with what it disperses and we can have faith in that... I am confident that if you do it... when you find a need you'll have something available to share... and I don't think that is at all bad. Your local college can help you set up the scholarship, and show you what you need to do to get more help... I know of a few families in our stake that have large scholarship funds, available to local students... their families support then 100%, in some cases it's multi-generational now.

In our case we have found that inviting youth into our home and family circle when impressed by the spirit to do so is a good alternative to giving them a handout... In addition there are always children and neighbors in every area how don't need a home but need help. Next time you are aware of a widow or family that has fallen on hard times in your immediate area take the opportunity to help them... then follow up. Stay in contact... It's a lovely cycle.

Encourage your children to serve others... no matter how young they are they can do something... A few minutes ago I got an email from one of the members here with two pictures for me, drawn by her daughter... That service is real... and while I am not poor in the things of the world, today I am poor in spirit and it means a LOT to me...

Staying close to the spirit is the best way I know to be able to give to the poor in a meaningful way... Perhaps that is my problem... I have stopped praying for opportunities to reach out...

I HAVE gotten lazy about giving... Thanks for the reminder...

Excellent ideas. Especially with the holidays coming up, I'd really like to DO SOMETHING and not just be overwhelmed with my own family busy-ness.

And FTR, I wasn't trying to imply doing personal things *in lieu of* my giving to the Church - this would be over and above Church donations.

There's a thing where our community makes shoeboxes for kids that are in some gov. aided housing or something... (see how out of it I am?)... I wish I could do something more personal. I'm sure you just go turn in the box at the front desk or whatever... I'm in no position to invite people into our home really, unless it was for a meal or something - not like moving in.

Then there's the Giving Tree or some deal at Wal-Mart. I picked a name once and looked at what they wanted on the back and it was a 12 yr. old and they wanted like an iPod with headphones or something. I'm thinking, "I'm not giving that away when my own kids don't get it!" So that sort of turned me off of that program...

I'd love to hear what people have done or are doing, especially as the holidays are approaching...

Of course there are those who take advantage of the system. The question is whether or not that's an excuse not to give and when?

I remember as a missionary once we were in the middle of nowhere, this guy comes up claims he just needs a couple bucks to get a bus ticket to go whereever. We both just explain how we're missionaries and really can't help him that way. About ten minutes later he comes out of this convenience store (where we were wiating for the bus) and he's got a new box of cookies he's bought. He offers us some, and explains that he's made a ton of money just asking people for money all day long. We didn't take his cookie... his poison cookie of greed!!!

--Ray

I wonder if King Benjamin's speech deals with the dishonest. Or is it just those who find themselves in that position because of their own honestly-done though bad choices...? Was he referring to the liars here, too?

Mosiah 4:16 And also, ye yourselves will succor those that stand in need of your succor; ye will administer of your substance unto him that standeth in need; and ye will not suffer that the beggar putteth up his petition to you in vain, and turn him out to perish.
17 Perhaps thou shalt asay: The man has brought upon himself his misery; therefore I will stay my hand, and will not give unto him of my food, nor impart unto him of my substance that he may not suffer, for his punishments are just
18 But I say unto you, O man, whosoever doeth this the same hath great cause to repent; and except he repenteth of that which he hath done he perisheth forever, and hath no interest in the kingdom of God.
19 For behold, are we not all beggars? Do we not all depend upon the same Being, even God, for all the substance which we have, for both food and raiment, and for gold, and for silver, and for all the riches which we have of every kind?
20 And behold, even at this time, ye have been calling on his name, and begging for a remission of your sins...etc..etc...

If I'm going to give, I'm going to give what helps. Giving five bucks to someone who may very well use it to damage themselves (alcohol, etc.) may classify me as a "giver" but what good has it done? Made me feel good? Helped me to "practice" generosity? I really think we can do better than that. We can put a little thought into our giving rather than the easy dollar handover. Doing so will do more for all parties involved.

I don't mean to be harsh or anything, I just see many "generous" people in the world that do what is quick and easy to feel good about giving but aren't helping the people they are giving to get much beyond that moment, beyond that day or beyond that week. That is not what true charity and welfare should be.

Don't run away, ray. Is he talkin' liars, or not?? Come on!

Coco, some things I have done when I have the means: that Giving Tree thing (not all of them ask for IPods!) I've also done a Toys for Tots tree and one for seniors. Call a local woman's shelter and ask what they really need. (I gave them new women's underwear and little toys for kids.) I have volunteered at a local soup kitchen. I have donated toys to foster agencies. I have given blood. (Though, I really hate that and don't do it enough.)

Call your ward humanitarian aid specialist, if you have one, and ask if they know of needs in the community. Some communities actually have phonelines and/or websites set up to find out how & where to volunteer. I'm assuming we're not just looking for ways to throw money at it, though you could do that as well with these groups.

I give tithing knowing the Church will use it for meeting houses, temples and etc. I pay fast offerings knowing that the Bishop doesn't use it to provide aid willy nilly and that the Church takes their stewardship over such funds seriously.

Ok, what are these attachments to this thread?  I smell the work of rayb on these.....

I'm experimenting with tagging threads so that you can find them more easily through the search feature. The author of a thread can tag it, and I can tag it. If it's bothersome I can remove the tags.

No, you don--

No, you d--

PollyAnna wrote:

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Okay... I give up Arbi... how does one add tags to a thread they authored???

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 If you've already authored it, look for the yellow tag in the footer of the thread. I believe that it's also by the thread title in the list for each forum. When you're writing a thread, it's a field labeled "tags".

I know we are talking more about giving money, but here is a good website I learned about a couple months ago. It is a nationwide database of volunteer opportunities. Just punch in your zipcode and area of interest, and lots of local opportunites appear. If you have the time, etc, then maybe will find opportunity to give money by participating in one of the activities:

http://www.volunteermatch.org/

Also, that site does list (at least in my area) "1:1 opportunities", ie a person __ age w/brain injury or whatever in need of someone to help play board games or whatever.

* in our area, around the holidays, they also publish "wish lists" from local agencies such as homeless shelters, etc. Something like that might be of use, if you have such a list in your area.

Here is my take.

I have worked in downtown settings and had the panhandlers everywhere. Many of them harass people. Many of the women were frightened of them as many were very aggressive. One man who asked for money from me, a number of times, say old story, just got out of jail and needed money to get somewhere. Most used the money for alcohol or drugs. There were missions down the street ready and willing to help them, but many do not want it.

Frankly, I believe that many choose to live like this, it is easy, no responsibility, etc. Yes, there are those that are mentally ill or who have rock bottom. The thing is there are facilities and programs to help such. The city where I worked actively discouraged giving to panhandlers and beggars for these very reasons.

Every once in while I would give something to someone, who in my estimation needed something. I prefer to give through fast offerings where I know it will be used wisely and must be accounted for. I prefer also to ensure that most will go to members of the church. I see it as the Lord's admonition that it is the responsibility of the church to care for widows and orphans. I would rather my fast offering money go to a poor member family in Africa than a panhandler on the street. It does not mean I do not care, but my funds are limited and I would rather see them spent well and wisely.

As to the church helping people, as mentioned there is humanitarian aid, which can include teaching, life skills, infrastructure, etc., and also the perpetual education fund. The church also has the employment centers to help people with interviewing and searching for employment.

I have been to many welfare meetings and find it is almost always the same people discussed. You could just make a tape recording of the last meeting and play it again. The problem is that many people have no skills, what do you do, really there is nothing you can do if they know nothing and many times are unwilling to learn. I have seen jobs and opportunities set up only to see someone just blow it off or put no effort in to it. There are often ways, just that many won't do it.

It reminds me of my brother. We both were raised in the church in a good family and each given the same opportunities and help. I did well in school, tried, went to college for a year, a mission, finisihed college, law school, full time employment, always active in the church (there have been times it has been lean and hard). My brother on the other hand barely got out of high school, drank and other stuff, parents willing to pay for school and then he would blow the money, got ready to go on a mission (not worthy) and then on the farewell date announced he was not going, joined the Army failed out of it, worked odd jobs, lived with a girl then got married and then divorced, never went to church, worked more odd jobs, lives with a woman now 15 years older than him, at age 37 finally got a full time job, and that was his biggest success, still begs my dad for money. My point is, many people just refuse to do it and as Ron White says, "You can't fix stupid."