If you were within the income, would you use food stamps, medicare (0r is it medicade), etc.? Do you feel, as a member of the CJCLDS that you should not?
When our first child was born, I was Airman First Class (junior enlisted, E-3) in the Air Force. The unit payroll and benefits person called me and said that we qualified for food stamps. I was really hesitant to take them. She explained that the military didn't pay their junior enlisted folks enough to realistically raise a family, and that those members were encouraged to use food stamps in order to free up that money to meet other obligations. We decided to use them until I was promoted to a high enough rank that we no longer qualified.
In my ideal world, the government would not provide those benefits. Churches and other charitable organizations would. But we don't live in that ideal world, although it's a goal worth working toward.
I think that food stamps are a good aid to families who are struggling. But I think there should be requirements attached, such as the recipients actively seeking employment or seeking to upgrade employment.
Finally as a member of the church, I think individuals in that situation should seek the aid of the church first. The Bishop's storehouse can provide the same benefits. Additionally, the storehouse is much more efficient and effective, and much less susceptible to fraud in the program.
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The ability to qualify for, receive, and act on personal revelation is the single most important skill that can be acquired in this life. - Julie Beck
When we lived in Utah back when Cat was an undergrad student, we, like most students were dirt poor. We could have more than qualified for food stamps, WIC and welfare, but we chose not to. I did have to go on Medicaid when I had our first two children, but we were kind of forced to because at the time BYU decided to triple the cost of the insurance premiums per semester to carry maternity coverage for students and their spouses AND they lowered the coverage. They wouldn't even grandfather those couples who were already in the middle of pregnancies like we were. There was no way we could have afforded the costs of the premiums and our out of pocket expenses. We hated having to do that, but BYU didn't leave us a whole lot of choice. My medicaid only lasted until the kids were like six months old. Which was fine.
I had neighbors at the time tell us we should get WIC and food stamps. One lady even told me,"It will save you lot's of money." Welfare and food stamps are not designed to "save people money." We managed without it.
Cat's Dad was regional welfare agent for years and years and the way the church welfare system is set up, if you are having difficulty you should first go to family for help and if they can't help then you go to the church and then you go to the government as a last resort. That's what the church counsels people to do.
In the type of work I have done over the years, I have seen ALOT of people on welfare. And, I also see the kinds of cars they drive and clothes they wear and jewelry and I see their wallets full of cash. So it sometimes kind of bugs me. You'd be surprised how many people are on welfare.
I don't hold it against anyone who is in a situation where they "truly" need government assistance. And, it is tempting when you are in dire straits or in a tough situation, but my opinion is one should not do it if they can possibly avoid it.
Even now, our oldest son who is disabled receives medicaid in addition to our private insurance. That's because the special program that delivers the services he receives actually "requires" him to be on medicaid. It's the only medicaid program in our state where the family's finances are not considered. It wouldn' matter how much we made. Sometimes I feel a little guilty for accepting medicaid for him. But, I admit the services he gets have been a true blessing because he has had alot of health issues.
The way the Church states it should be handled is (as my sweet Poncho stated): 1. Self / immediate family. 2. If one's self / immediate family can not provide for the needs, then the extended family. 3. If the extended family is not able (or willing), the Church for certain needs. This could be intrepreted to mean this is the counsel The Lord provides us to stay free.
Recieving or asking for government aid is not a sin, and in some instances is compatible with receiving aid from the Church. A frank discussion with the Bishop should be had. But one really needs to weigh the pluses against the negatives about accepting any governmental welfare type aids for long term. Short term, sometimes it may be necessary, but one needs to be very careful about making themselves dependent upon them, as the programs can become intrusive and make spiritual slaves of those who do rely on them perpetually as they become even less self-reliant.
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It seems to me the only thing you've learned is that Caesar is a "salad dressing dude."
Poncho- don't feel guilty about your son receiving Medicaid. I just wrote a lengthy response that got eaten :( :( after I pushed reply, so here is my second attempt.) But basically, in its truest form, medicaid exists to help support those such as your son. Don't feel guilty, it is the govt way to help you out in all the extra lifetime expenses you will incur due to his special needs.
When I used to work at the state of va facility for those w/severe and profound physical and developmental disabilities, our director once referenced a quote that said, 'the truest measure of a society is how it cares for those who can't care for themselves'.
Some cheat the system. But for those who are honestly doing their best or who are truly in need, they deserve this benefit. As a taxpayer, I am glad medicaid helps people such as your son or the people for whom I used to care. However, i don't like that certain people get away w/fraud (if it is true: ie the friend of a coworker who feigned mental illness so he could be locked up in a mental health facility and avoid paying his child support).
Around 1970 = or - a couple years, there was considerable admonishment to LDSs to not use other than church welfare, and especially food stamps. I distinctly recall BYU President Wilkinson stating that any student using food stamps would be exxpelled from the university. An acquaintance of mine took a job with the welfare office in Provo, and told me that LDSs were among the applicnts for food stamps.
I'm pretty sure that in recent years that church policy has changed, by virtue of the fact that certain members in our ward in AZ who are unable to meet their needs are directed by the bishop to civil welfare agencies.
I think I stated this before, but I believe if a person has been compelled to pay into the Social Security system and pay for unemployment insurance, etc, said person is entitled to draw from that system over time until the original payments are recovered. Factoring in $ devaluation over the years, I'll not get my value back from SS until about 2016. Also to consider is if tithing was already paid on the money withheld for SS, company pension funds, etc.
I should not have included WIC. It is my opinion that WIC is not the same as food stamps, etc. WIC supplies the necessary nutrients that a child might not get if not for the WIC program. By ensuring each child has a healthy beginning, we are preventing other, longer-lasting problems.
IMHO, if you qualify for WIC, you should be using it.
WHen I was unemployed we qualified for WIC, cuz of the new baby. I thought the program was nice, if something of a hastle. Haven't done the foodstamp thing. I hear you can get booze with them, though... so there's a plus.
--Ray
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I'm not slow; I'm special. (Don't take it personally, everyone finds me offensive. Yet somehow I manage to live with myself.)
Unless things have changed from when I was a cashier in a grocery store years ago then I regret to tell you my dear Ray that you cannot buy booze with food stamps. Sorry to burst your bubble! I hope that doesn't put a damper on your keg party Friday night.
But you can, and people often enough do, buy wedding cakes with food stamps.
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"The promptings of the Holy Ghost will always be sufficient for our needs if we keep to the covenant path. Our path is uphill most days, but the help we receive for the climb is literally divine." --Elaine S. Dalton
So how hard-core are you, cat? Would you sell your retirement property that you're sure will triple in value over the next 10 years in order to subsidize your grown married children a few hundred each a month so they don't have to get outside assistance? How far does this "family first" thing go? I mean, if we really had no other options, sure we'd find ways to pool all our money, etc... Aren't we just getting back some of our wrongfully-taken income tax anyway?
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Life is tough but it's tougher if you're stupid. -John Wayne
lundie- Would that be ERNEST Wilkinson? The one who wouldn't shake Hugh Nibley's hand because he wasn't a high enough ranking military person... or how did that go?
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Life is tough but it's tougher if you're stupid. -John Wayne
I was on WIC for a short time when DH was unemployed and never felt apologetic about it. We used it when we needed it, and we've both put into the system WAY more than we ever took from it (in cheese and beans).
Don't get me started on the people I saw when I went in to get my checks, though. Or their super nice cars, or brand-name clothes. . .
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"There is order in the way the Lord reveals His will to mankind. . .we cannot receive revelation for someone else's stewardship." L. Tom Perry
I have a SIL who won't get married to her boyfriend, the father of her second child, because she'd lose her food stamps and whatnot with both incomes. So, they just live in sin. To me, that's a big part of what's wrong with our goverment welfare programs. They provide no incentive to marry and plenty to not.
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"The promptings of the Holy Ghost will always be sufficient for our needs if we keep to the covenant path. Our path is uphill most days, but the help we receive for the climb is literally divine." --Elaine S. Dalton
I didn't mean to imply that the government makes their choices for them. But the benefits of the welfare program are set up in a way that it benefits people more to not get married. To me, that is just sad.
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"The promptings of the Holy Ghost will always be sufficient for our needs if we keep to the covenant path. Our path is uphill most days, but the help we receive for the climb is literally divine." --Elaine S. Dalton
We got some food stamps when I was in law school to help cover costs at the time. I figure I have repaid that multiple times. I look at it as getting some of my money back that is forcefully taken from me by the government.
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Lo, there I see my mother, my sisters, my brothers Lo, there I see the line of my people back to the beginning Lo, they call to me, they bid me take my place among them In the halls of Valhalla, where the brave may live...forever
I understand that foodstamps are now issued via a credit card called Quest. While it probably cannot be used for booze outright, I have noticed that you can get cash advances from it. Thereby enabling one to use "foodstamps" to buy booze.
There used to be a lot of fraud in the food stamps back in the old paper days thanks to counterfitting. There were also problems with people selling foodstamps for rediculously low amounts so they could buy booze, cigs, drugs, etc. They went to the card to help stop it. I'm sure it still happens though.
I understand that foodstamps are now issued via a credit card called Quest. While it probably cannot be used for booze outright, I have noticed that you can get cash advances from it. Thereby enabling one to use "foodstamps" to buy booze.
In our state it's called the bridge card. I had someone try to use it to pay for their prescription and they had medicaid too and so their co-pay was only a $1.00 as it was. They were annoyed they couldn't do that!
I wonder if the card is limited in its use to businesses that sell food. I had a health savings account once where the card worked that way - it could only be used at businesses classified as "medical" by the credit card company.
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If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen! - Samuel Adams
