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Post Info TOPIC: McCain


Senior Member

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McCain


http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/politics/20070410_mccain_vmi.pdf


That is the link to McCain's Virginia Military Institute speech given April 12th. 
Great speech.  And what he said is absolutely right.

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Wise and Revered Master

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Absolutely right on some issues and completely wrong on others. I respect McCains service to our country and the sacrifices he made on our behalf but I cannot give him my vote in the primary. The only way he earns my vote is if the only alternative is Hillary or Obama.

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God Made Man, Sam Colt Made Him Equal.

Jason



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Are you saying that overall he is right on on some issues and wrong on others overall or was your statement in regards to this particular speech?  If it was directed to the speech, what did you agree with or not?

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Wise and Revered Master

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In general, I don't agree much with McCain. I blame him for being a weenie when it came to the gang of seven. He is dead right on Iraq though and I agree with his statement in this speech, specifically the third paragraph when he starts talking about his fifth visit to Iraq. I disagree with his statement that the "Vast majority of muslims are trying to modernize their societies to meet the challenges of the 21st Century" I just don't see it. Where is this happening? There are those in Islam trying to speak out but I don't see them as the vast majority. I see the vast majority sitting on their hands while the radicals hijack their religion and a few brave souls especially among the female critics risk death, rape, or mutilation speaking out against radical Islam. When he speaks of the stronger alliances that the U.S. needs I think he is talking pie in the sky. Europe wants to do nothing that will make them a target for terror and that's not George Bush's or anyone else's fault. Europe frankly just doesn't care. If not for Tony Blair I wonder where we would be. I also think that the Australians are one of the few who see the threat for what it is and give Howard credit where credit is due. I think he (McCain) was right to argue for more troops back in 1993 but he isn't a general at the Pentagon or in Iraq or the Commander in Chief.  He can make all the arguments he wants but he is not in a position to make those decisions.  It is also easy to look back and monday morning quarterback this thing to death just like some continue to do with WWII, Vietnam, the Civil War, etc.

I also agree that much of his assessment of what would happen in Iraq if we leave is spot on. McCain can be rather Hawkish but his time in the Senate has left me scratching my head in wonder. His candidacy for president does not get me very excited. Does that answer your question?

-- Edited by salesortonscom at 14:38, 2007-04-16

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God Made Man, Sam Colt Made Him Equal.

Jason



Hot Air Balloon

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I do like McCain's stance on Congressional spending...



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(Don't take it personally, everyone finds me offensive. Yet somehow I manage to live with myself.)


Profuse Pontificator

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AZ Senator John McCain, I'm convinced, is a globalist trying to position himself to eventually gain access to, or be part of, the inner circle of the New World Order leadership in order to become part of the decision-making process that shapes our world.  He has been pushing for amnesty for illegals, and is no friend of gun owners.  He is basically a poor excuse for a conservative.  His voting record stinks of socialism.  Among other things, he: 
* voted in favour of $21 billion for unconstitutional foreign aid in 2006,
* voted against S1042, which would have required the President to give Congress a timetable for withdrawal from Iraq within 30 days of implimentation of the bill,
* voted to incrrease the federal/national debt limit to $8.97 trillion, an increase of $781 billion in what the FedGov is allowed to "borrow",
* voted in favour of S2611, which would effectively grant amnesty for the X million illegals already in the U.S.A., and create a guest worker program for up to 200K immigrants per year,
* played a major role in promoting legislation to restrict the power of the government to torture and then selling out in a final "compromise" that was really no compromise at all.

He, like Giuliani, has been an immoral rascal in his personal life.  Did I hear right that Utah Gov. Huntsman is supporting McCain?



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Senior Bucketkeeper

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The Huntsman family is trying to play it safe... the Gov. is supporting McCain, his dad is supporting Mitt.

Having lived in AZ for 20 years and having voted against McCain every time he ran for Senate, you might say I'm anti-McCain. Sadly, Matt Salmon is also supporting McCain. I don't get it.

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no unhallowed hand can stop the work from progressing... the truth of God will go forth till it has penetrated every website, sounded in every ear, till the purposes of God shall be accomplished and the great Jehovah shall say the work is done


Profuse Pontificator

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McCain is too old.

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I'm not voting for Ron Paul because it's not expressly prescribed in the Constitution.


Profuse Pontificator

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Thru me own political activities I got somewhat acquainted with former AZ Governor Evan Meacham by emails and chatting with him, of all places, in the Mesa, AZ Temple, where he was a temple worker.  We discussed, among other things, where McCain was going politically.  One day, during a brief chat, he said to me "McCain is an evil man", and his reasons included some of his personal and political activities.  Incidentally, both men had similar experiences that led to their POW captivity, Meacham in WW2 and McCain in Vietnam.  Meacham never, to my knowledge, considered himself a "war hero" or let himself be portrayed as one.

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Head Chef

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McCain is a RINO (republican in name only). I consider his activities in helping to block the nominations of judges to be reprehensible. I would not vote for him even if you stood in the voting booth with me holding a knife to my throat.
How glad I am that I am not limited to only two choices when voting for president.

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If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!
- Samuel Adams


Wise and Revered Master

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lundbaek wrote:

AZ Senator John McCain, I'm convinced, is a globalist trying to position himself to eventually gain access to, or be part of, the inner circle of the New World Order leadership in order to become part of the decision-making process that shapes our world.  He has been pushing for amnesty for illegals, and is no friend of gun owners.  He is basically a poor excuse for a conservative.  His voting record stinks of socialism.  Among other things, he: 
* voted in favour of $21 billion for unconstitutional foreign aid in 2006,
* voted against S1042, which would have required the President to give Congress a timetable for withdrawal from Iraq within 30 days of implimentation of the bill,
* voted to incrrease the federal/national debt limit to $8.97 trillion, an increase of $781 billion in what the FedGov is allowed to "borrow",
* voted in favour of S2611, which would effectively grant amnesty for the X million illegals already in the U.S.A., and create a guest worker program for up to 200K immigrants per year,
* played a major role in promoting legislation to restrict the power of the government to torture and then selling out in a final "compromise" that was really no compromise at all.

He, like Giuliani, has been an immoral rascal in his personal life.  Did I hear right that Utah Gov. Huntsman is supporting McCain?




His amnesty for illegals and his anti gun stance alone earn him no support from me.  As Arb pointed out, he was instrumental in hurting the confirmation of good federal judges.  He definitely qualifies as a Rino!



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God Made Man, Sam Colt Made Him Equal.

Jason



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My beef with McCain includes his attempt (which succeeded to some extent) to nullify the 1st Amendment of the Constitution.

The McCain-Feingold law holds that political speech in the days before an election can only be funded by the "establishment." Democrats and Republicans conspired to keep free speech (or the funding of it) out of the hands of the unwashed masses. Incredibly, this was upheld by the Supreme Court.


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I believe McCain still employs a tactic he used as a POW.  He would mislead and change stories to aggravate his interrogators, trying to use his sheer will power against agonizing  physical and mental torture.  It was the only way he could avoid a mental and emotional collapse and stay ahead of his captors.

Now as a "captive" of the Senate, he's a maverick, doing what he wants when he wants.  Maybe as a Senator it brings him strategic and political points, but it frightens me what kind of President he would be. He seems as unstable as water, and his so called convictions seem hollow.


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"The void is the supreme fullness." Simone Weil


Understander of unimportant things

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Very interesting comment on his tactics.

I was going to say "Very interesting, Mr. Bond" in honor of your avatar, but then realized that was a mixed metaphor... mixing the following Simpsons spoof

[Homer is a Blackjack dealer]
Ernst Stavro Blofeld: Twenty. Your move, Mr. Bond.
James Bond: I'll take a hit, dealer. [Homer deals Bond a card.] Joker? You're supposed to take these out of the deck.
Homer: Oh, sorry, I'll give you another one.
[Homer deals Bond another card.]
James Bond: What's this? "Rules for Draw and Stud Poker"?
Ernst Stavro Blofeld: What a pity, Mr. Bond...
[Oddjob and Jaws advance on Bond and grab him.]
James Bond: But... but wait! It was Homer's fault. I can't lose! I never lose!
[Oddjob and Jaws drag Bond out of the casino.] At least tell me your plans for world domination!
Ernst Stavro Blofeld: Oh ho ho, I'm not falling for THAT one again.

with something else... not sure what, but something else... maybe it was just the "What a pity, Mr. Bond..." Oh well... weirdface  biggrin

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Hot Air Balloon

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When I was younger and single, I felt a great deal of pressure to get married. Problem was there was no girl that lived up to my high standards...

Luckily I got over myself, and found a lovely woman who agreed to marry me and we have a beautiful family...

I find it remarkable that men of the past were able to compromise their high standards enough to found this country. Sometimes I think all this gloom and doom and utter inability to see anything positive about a candidate does no one any good and leaves us all feeling alone and abandoned, stressed and without a beautiful wife and family... ;)

--Ray



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I'm not slow; I'm special.
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Head Chef

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Ray, would you count it as pessimistic if someone didn't hire a child molester to babysit their children? McCain simply isn't qualified to run this country, and I will unabashedly say so. That said, there are some great candidates out there. One, Ron Paul, is even running for the republican nomination. Realizing that someone is utterly unqualified is not the same as being pessimistic. I even expressed earlier how glad I am that I am given choices. There are good choices out there. There are also some particularly bad ones.

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If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!
- Samuel Adams


Senior Bucketkeeper

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I was grateful for McCain's comic relief this week.

Q: "Senator McCain, how should this country deal with the problem of Iran?"

Maverik: "Bomb, Bomb, Bomb, Bomb-Bomb Iran; Bomb, bomb, bomb, bomb-bomb Iran..."


Put a smile across this face....smile.gif

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no unhallowed hand can stop the work from progressing... the truth of God will go forth till it has penetrated every website, sounded in every ear, till the purposes of God shall be accomplished and the great Jehovah shall say the work is done


Hot Air Balloon

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Nice comparison Arbi. What's next? Hitler? You prove my point.

Mahonri: I agree, that was amusing.

--Ray

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I'm not slow; I'm special.
(Don't take it personally, everyone finds me offensive. Yet somehow I manage to live with myself.)


Head Chef

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Ray, I think that perhaps you fail to see my point. You're saying that you should pick a candidate that fills at least a majority (51%) of your requirements, and not get too picky about the rest or you'll never get a candidate that you like elected. My point is that McCain only fills about 2% or 3% of my requirements. Therefore voting for him would be a complete and utter waste of my vote. If I have to settle that far to find a candidate, what's the point of the political process anymore?

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If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!
- Samuel Adams


Hot Air Balloon

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No I'm saying that some people are incapble of saying nice things about McCain, that they cannot conceive of the world even survive his presidency, and that he has absolutely no strengths worth mentioning.

Negative... negative... negative...

--Ray

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I'm not slow; I'm special.
(Don't take it personally, everyone finds me offensive. Yet somehow I manage to live with myself.)


Senior Bucketkeeper

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Ray you are right.

Everything about him is negative, negative, negative. smile.gif

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no unhallowed hand can stop the work from progressing... the truth of God will go forth till it has penetrated every website, sounded in every ear, till the purposes of God shall be accomplished and the great Jehovah shall say the work is done


Hot Air Balloon

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You poor poor man. rolleyes It's a good thing I love you not solely for your compassion towards politicians with whom you disagree. biggrin

--Ray

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I'm not slow; I'm special.
(Don't take it personally, everyone finds me offensive. Yet somehow I manage to live with myself.)


Senior Member

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Wait a minute! McCain is a child molestor? I'm not buying it!

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"The void is the supreme fullness." Simone Weil


Hot Air Balloon

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Yeah. I had a problem with that comparison too...rolleyes

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I'm not slow; I'm special.
(Don't take it personally, everyone finds me offensive. Yet somehow I manage to live with myself.)
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