Okay, so...my daughter turns 5 Oct. 4th this year. In Arizona, the cutoff for kindergarten is Sept. 1st.
In vocabulary, reading skills, math skills, writing skills, social attitudes, etc. she seems to me to be completely ready for school. I've done a lot of reading on early admission research, and I think she's a good candidate.
I contacted a public information officer for the school district, and she said they don't have a process for this issue, but I could contact the principal of the school. (I have thought about just doing home schooling or something--either permanently or until she could enter public school, but it doesn't feel like the right answer for us right now.)
So, I've been trying to work myself up to calling the principal (I emailed but got no response) to discuss this. I have two problems. First, I still feel mildly scared to talk to the principal. I realize I'm an adult, and a parent now, but I still feel like a kid who wants nothing more than to NEVER have to talk to the principal. I'm trying to tell myself that she just wants to do the best for the students and could use parental insight... Anyway, I am trying to get over this.
The second problem, and the one I'm mainly seeking advice for, is how to broach the subject with her. I kind of have this idea that the first thing I say will set the tone for this whole discussion (assuming it ever gets anywhere), and I don't want to screw it up.
I even went to my business correspondence manual for persuasive requests... So, what would be the best thing. To just state that I think my child is a good candidate for early admission based on such-and-such? To ask to speak with her about evaluating my child's school readiness? To talk about evaluating readiness...without mentioning that she's past the cutoff? To list research or arguments in favor?
I'm kind of freezing myself into a scared-to-do-anything mode. Help?
Well, my first thought would have been homeschool the kid (I'm biased, I know) but you said that you had prayed about that and it wasn't the right choice for you. My advice? Find out the fax number for the principle's office. It should be easily available on the internet, or at worst call the office and ask "What's your fax number?" Then collect your thoughts in a letter and fax it to him. Give him a half an hour or an hour. Then call him and ask, "I would like to discuss the fax I sent you." That way you have already presented your thoughts in a clear, non-threatening manner. He will also not be able to ignore it, since you follow up with a call. If he has not read it, either give him a minute while you're on the phone to read it, or call him back after he has had a reasonable amount of time to read it.
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If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen! - Samuel Adams
Principals have way too much to do on a daily basis. Your request is going to be at the bottom of a principal's list of priorities whether you fax or email it. You likely will get no response.
Call and set up an appointment (not Monday or Friday) and go in person. You're a parent who has some concerns about admission for your child next year. That's all they need to know up front.
At the meeting, keep it brief. No more that 10 minutes. Be as respectful as possible with the principal's time. Be bold but not overbearing
And be fully prepared for a "No." Administration is very cautious about making exceptions for individual cases on any matter of policy. But don't take no for a final answer. Be prepared to try another school or go back to the district. You may also want to consider playing the "I want her to be tested for the gifted and talented program" card. Use it carefully.
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The ability to qualify for, receive, and act on personal revelation is the single most important skill that can be acquired in this life. - Julie Beck
It would also help if you contemplated the question in the celestial room. That has helped me in the past, especially when we made the decision to homeschool our son. The answer didn't come immediately, but it did come soon.
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If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen! - Samuel Adams
Roper wrote: There's a question in the Celestial Room? is it written in symbols or something? Because I've never seen it.
It's all about context, Roper. Euphrasie put a question to us. We've been giving her advice. From context, it follows that the question referred to is the question that we've been discussing.
I admit, though, that I could have been less ambiguous in my phrasing, I could have instead said, "ponder, in the celestial room, the question of your child's education."
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If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen! - Samuel Adams
I'm hoping to make it to the temple soon (a little tricky with a baby). Although, I don't need to find more reasons to put off talking about this right now.
Is there a way to 'not take no for an answer' without setting myself up in an adversarial relationship with the school admin?
I like the 10 minute meeting plan... When is a good time to call about that? In the morning? After school? Should I call the principal directly? (I'm not sure I have another phone number, actually. The school just opened in Jan.)
Roper wrote: There's a question in the Celestial Room? is it written in symbols or something? Because I've never seen it.
Yes, it is how do you manage to get two couples to sit on one of the Celestial Room couches that are not quite full length couches but are also too long to be considered love seats without the fourth person ending up in the lap of at least one of the other three already sitting there.
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It seems to me the only thing you've learned is that Caesar is a "salad dressing dude."
Euphrasie wrote: (And thanks for your responses, gentlemen. I was really hoping to hear from you two, particularly, when I posted.)
Be careful, Euphrasie, you'll give me an inflated opinion of myself. And you're welcome for the advice, of course. One more bit of advice; the Principal (if he's a reasonable person) will not bite your head off for making a reasonable request. There is nothing shameful or wrong about wanting an exception to the attendance rule for your daughter.
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If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen! - Samuel Adams
Roper wrote: There's a question in the Celestial Room? is it written in symbols or something? Because I've never seen it.
Yes, it is how do you manage to get two couples to sit on one of the Celestial Room couches that are not quite full length couches but are also too long to be considered love seats without the fourth person ending up in the lap of at least one of the other three already sitting there.
As a total aside, my favorite celestial room is the two story celestial room in the San Diego temple. But I'm probably biased, since I was married in that temple. The Oakland celestial room is very nice, with its singing chandelier. I've probably been in the Denver celestial room more often than I have in any other, but it doesn't seem to differentiate itself from other celestial rooms; it's just a really nice place to be.
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If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen! - Samuel Adams
Roper wrote: There's a question in the Celestial Room? is it written in symbols or something? Because I've never seen it.
Yes, it is how do you manage to get two couples to sit on one of the Celestial Room couches that are not quite full length couches but are also too long to be considered love seats without the fourth person ending up in the lap of at least one of the other three already sitting there.
As a total aside, my favorite celestial room is the two story celestial room in the San Diego temple. But I'm probably biased, since I was married in that temple. The Oakland celestial room is very nice, with its singing chandelier. I've probably been in the Denver celestial room more often than I have in any other, but it doesn't seem to differentiate itself from other celestial rooms; it's just a really nice place to be.
I have to say from experience, I think the Celestial room in the small temples is probably only about as big as the sealing room I was married in in the Washington D.C. Temple... Of course, the small temples only have a maximum capacity of something like 50 or 60 for a session... So, by the time everyone is through, if they all stay in the Celestial room, it is pretty much standing room only.
Oh, back on topic... Euphie, does the district have a pre-K program you can still get your daughter into? That may be a way to go, particularly if your child is past the birthday cut off date for automatically being enrolled into kindergarten. You would probably have to pay for it, and it would most likely only be 1/2 a day two or three days a week, but it may be something to look into. Our 4 year old is in one right now, and his older sister went through it too several years ago. I don't know what the cut off date is in our district, but he won't be 5 until late October, so kind of the same thing you're talking about.
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It seems to me the only thing you've learned is that Caesar is a "salad dressing dude."
Just in case, I contacted the ECC. They don't do pre-K evaluations...and the woman there pretty much laughed at my chances of getting my daughter in early in any district around here.
But I'm still going to try to meet with the principal. I can only do my best and see what happens.
Even if you can't get her in this year it is very important to be involved in your children's school. I know it may be hard to overcome your fear of the principal but it is very important. You will be the only advocate at your school for your child. You have to be involved with your child's school in order to make sure that your child is not being treated like the latchkey crack addict kids. Your child's teacher should know you by first and last name and know you enough that they know your values and expectations. The same goes for the principal. I recommend attending all parent teacher conferences and also volunteering in the classroom and in the parent teacher club. So many parents are not involved at all in their child's education that you will stand out as a hero. Then if there is a problem, you are not just some spoiled parent coming to complain about the spoiled brat child who the principal wouldn't know by name if he saw them. You have a relationship with the teacher and the principal and that will make the difference. It works, I've seen it with my own kids.
It may be that th school principal is not the one to start with. We had a similar problem years ago when a teacher and the district "shrink" wanted one of our kids to repeat a grade because he had been the previous 2 years in grade school in Italy, and his English was a bit mixed with 2 other languages, Italian and Danish. The distict "shrink" tested him in my presence and used some culturally biased questions. We got to the district remedial reading teacher and she was happy to re-test the kid and persuaded the school princpal that he was ready to move on.
Also, the last thing you want to do is get started on the wrong foot with school administration.
We had a problem with #1 and the rest of the kids have now had to deal with it.
We should have moved.
At least in our school district here in the valley o' the sun, it's a hard and fast rule. If you are born after Sept 1st forget it.
Good luck anyway.
I'll be in the Mesa Temple this Friday afternoon. :0)
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no unhallowed hand can stop the work from progressing... the truth of God will go forth till it has penetrated every website, sounded in every ear, till the purposes of God shall be accomplished and the great Jehovah shall say the work is done
BTW, I don't know if my experience is any guide, but I was placed into kindergarten at 4, and I was held back a year because it was deemed that I was too young and it would be hard for me socially. Oh, and it is definitely possible to get on the wrong side a of a principal, but in my opinion, it's not the end of the world. And volunteering helps make you look like one of the good guys (or in Euphrasie's case, girls). And you can totally be not at fault. My wife missed a parent/teacher conference (we usually didn't miss them) because she was in her first trimester and feeling *very* sick. We called and told them. But they were dead set on their course, held the meeting without us, and chose to put our son in a special program. Instead of letting him languish in such a program, we chose to homeschool him. A couple of years later it's going well. Not perfectly, just well. I'm still not sure how we got on that principal's wrong side, but the fact is that we did. It led us into the choice the Lord wanted us to make, though, so I can't complain.
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If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen! - Samuel Adams
Hey y'all. Remember this discussion? Two years ago? I was just thinking about you all and thought I'd come post an update. Trusting the Lord really makes everything work out right. :D
So, I had several discussions with the principal at the time. She was very friendly and seemed really willing to try to make things work. When it came around to registration time, however, she backed out on the basis of a local school leaders meeting consensus. Or something. I got the impression that she wanted out of the deal without having it be 'her fault.' I was a little annoyed at the turnaround. We found a local charter school that accepted 'pre-K' kindergarten students, but it is very small and had limited slots open. We stayed on the waiting list all summer and never made it in, so I did casual homeschooling (not knowing if she'd have to do kindergarten the next year). It was fine. She learned new things, made progress... But by the end of the school year I was burnt out. Probably why homeschooling wasn't the permanent answer for us.
So, we talked to the principal again about transferring into first grade. But, since kindergarten technically isn't required, there's an age limit for first grade as well. The principal's advice was to 'just register her and don't say anything about her age in case they don't catch it.' That seemed rather odd advice, but with the principal's knowledge and okay, I was willing to give it a try. Then she came and backed out again, saying that unless we had a certificate of kindergarten completion, she wouldn't go for it. By this time, I had a really bad taste in my mouth dealing with this principal. We went back to the charter school and got on the waiting list again (for first grade). Summer came and went, and I was getting ready (with my sour grapes) to register for kindergarten.
Faith and persistence finally won out. The charter school started class two weeks before the public school. Four days into their first week, I got a call. They'd had a student not show and had an open slot for a first grade student and were we interested? I went immediately over to fill out paperwork. They asked about what we'd done for homeschooling, if I was familiar with state standards, and did I think she was ready for first grade. She started class the following Monday, and she's excelling, top reading/spelling groups, additional reading challenges with another teacher, special strategic thinking group after school once a week... Her teacher said that it was fortunate things worked out because she could see that spending a year in kindergarten would not have been good for her.
I call it more than fortunate. It's a ginormous blessing. I love the administration at the charter school. The teachers go above and beyond. I love the small-school, parent-involved feel. I'm so glad I didn't just give up on that niggling 'feeling' about what my daughter needed. The bonus nice thing? Siblings of current students get priority placement, so my younger two pre-K kids have a decent chance of starting kindergarten when they're ready (whether that's pre-K year or the standard year will be a matter for another prayer, but the option is open).
Sorry for the long-winded post. But I just wanted to share the prayers-answered ending to the story.
I'm glad that you found a solution to your problem - and it really is individual for everyone. I'm glad that your daughter has found a place where her love of learning can be excercised.
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If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen! - Samuel Adams
is it written in symbols or something? Because I've never seen it. 
Be careful, Euphrasie, you'll give me an inflated opinion of myself.
