Why the LDS aversion to the cross?

Valhalla · Profuse Pontificator

Why the LDS aversion to the cross?

LoudmouthMormon · Profuse Pontificator

Well, there's popular mormon culture, and then there's everything else. I refuse to answer for popmoculture's aversion. As far as everything else goes, we don't avoid the cross, we just prefer to emphasize the resurrection. The symbol of everything Christ came to accomplish is captured better in the images of him standing there with marks on His hands, a resurrected being, than in his agony on the cross.

LM

beefche · Profuse Pontificator

I have mixed feelings on the cross as well. Some crosses are beautiful works of art and I can appreciate them for that. Also, it is symbolic for people--represents Christ's suffering and atonement.

However, I think it also emphasizes his suffering. I can only base this on my observations as I've attended other churches over the years. But, little is mentioned of the resurrection--Christ's suffering is emphasized. Many Christian songs talk graphically about the blood of Christ.

I recently attended a Baptist funeral. The emphasis during this funeral was the suffering by Christ to save us. The preacher repeatedly talked about how we need to be saved and that He is there to save us. What struck me was that all that was asked was to accept Christ as your savior--you could do so by raising your hand as a pledge to accept Him. On the one hand--how simple and profound! He is there waiting for us to accept Him. On the other hand, it is more than verbally accepting Him--I didn't hear mention of keeping the commandments, or making any sort of effort (grace vs. works I suppose).

Cocobeem · Keeper of the Holy Grail

I actually like the cross - all the different kinds. I don't care for the bloody images of Christ on it particularly, but I mean, that's what the world knows as the symbol for Christianity. No cross = No Christians. So what do we use? Angel Moroni instead? Yeah, and we get on the Catholics for praying to Mary? Okay...

coolcucumbers · Senior Member

I've always liked the cross. The beautiful artsy type.
When I was a teenager a friend gave me one. I mentioned it in YW's once and my advisor gave me a lecture on why we as LDS don't worship the cross. I was like, um....not worshiping it, just think it's a beautiful reminder of the sacrifice my Savior made for me. Plus, you should see it, it's really beautiful!

arbilad · Head Chef

I wouldn't forbid my son if he wanted to wear a cross, but I would explain that the symbol is not important to our religion. Many have given good reasons. I think that another good reason is to help us realize that we're not another protestant religion - that we really are a restored church. So it's not that the cross is bad or anything, just that we choose to remember his sacrifice and resurrection in different ways. Just like there's nothing wrong with wearing a reversed collar like Catholic priests do, but it's not something we do to represent our religion.

Cocobeem · Keeper of the Holy Grail

Is some other mortal, say... angel Moroni, more appropriate then to use as our "representative" rather than the cross? Does this go back to the "all Churches are an abomination" idea? Did Joseph Smith say anything about the cross? How did this all start anyway?

Cocobeem · Keeper of the Holy Grail

Don't let the thread die, pleeeeease!

hiccups · Future Queen in Zion

But if it did, would we put a cross on the tombstone?

coolcucumbers · Senior Member

does anyone know the answers to coco's questions?
I'd like to know as well.

arbilad · Head Chef

Cocobeem wrote:

Is some other mortal, say... angel Moroni, more appropriate then to use as our "representative" rather than the cross? Does this go back to the "all Churches are an abomination" idea? Did Joseph Smith say anything about the cross? How did this all start anyway?

I can't claim to know where the practice started, but I had some ideas about why we put the angel Moroni on the tops of our temples instead of a cross. The angel moroni is a symbol of the whole gift that the Lord has given us. He is resurrected, and that is possible because of Christ dieing and rising again on the third day. He brought news of the plan and how Christ has made it possible to come back to him. The cross is really only a symbol of a part of the whole process.

Valhalla · Profuse Pontificator

Cocobeem wrote:

Is some other mortal, say... angel Moroni, more appropriate then to use as our "representative" rather than the cross? Does this go back to the "all Churches are an abomination" idea? Did Joseph Smith say anything about the cross? How did this all start anyway?

I understand the angel Moroni as delivering the Book of Mormon as the keystone of our religion, no real problem there, and I can see for differentiating us from other general Christian religions.

I don't think it goes to all churches being an abomination, I think it goes mostly as a separation, we are different, not another flavor, but something altogether different.

I don't that Joseph mentioned anything at all.

As to how it started, my thought is the differentiation aspect from other churches and more of a focus on the Risen Christ and completion of His mission. Though, one could argue that the empty cross, like the empty tomb, is symbolic of Christ's victory.

What I do like about the cross, is that because of its association with Christianity, it stands out, people recognize it and know what it means. I admit that I like seeing the cross perched high on a hill, as it is a reminder to me and is symbolic of what Christ did, and also, because it annoys the ACLU and other haters.

As a symbol, really, what do the LDS use as a symbol that says "I am a believer."? In that case the angel Moroni does not really work. I remember the rush a few years ago for the church to place steeples on chapels, never really understood it. I think it was some outward expression to the world that we too are Christian, but without using the cross to express it.

Pres. Hinckley stated:

Following the renovation of the Mesa Arizona Temple some years ago, clergy of other religions were invited to tour it on the first day of the open house period. Hundreds responded. In speaking to them, I said we would be pleased to answer any queries they might have. Among these was one from a Protestant minister.

Said he: Ive been all through this building, this temple which carries on its face the name of Jesus Christ, but nowhere have I seen any representation of the cross, the symbol of Christianity. I have noted your buildings elsewhere and likewise find an absence of the cross. Why is this when you say you believe in Jesus Christ?

I responded: I do not wish to give offense to any of my Christian colleagues who use the cross on the steeples of their cathedrals and at the altars of their chapels, who wear it on their vestments, and imprint it on their books and other literature. But for us, the cross is the symbol of the dying Christ, while our message is a declaration of the Living Christ.

He then asked: If you do not use the cross, what is the symbol of your religion?

I replied that the lives of our people must become the most meaningful expression of our faith and, in fact, therefore, the symbol of our worship.

http://www.lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?vgnextoid=2354fccf2b7db010VgnVCM1000004d82620aRCRD&locale=0&sourceId=2934d326b221c010VgnVCM1000004d82620a____&hideNav=1

So, I understand what Pres. Hinckley was saying, but then look at the symbolism on and in our temples, the endowment itself, baptism, sacrament, even Christmas trees, etc. While I do not wear, let alone possess a cross, I don't see a problem, though I really do not like the ones with Christ on them. I think a lot of LDS tend to take it and other things to an extreme, I think if it brings you closer to Christ and building a personal relationship, fine, but if it, like anything else, becomes an obsession or alters your course, then best stay away.

I don't have one in our home, as it bothers my wife as in the aforementioned reasons, and my kids aren't use to it, not an issue for me anyway, and if I had one it would be a Celtic one for decorative purposes. We have in our living room a picture of Christ returning.

Valhalla · Profuse Pontificator

From a talk from Marvin J. Ashton:

"Many nonmembers who visit our chapels wonder why we dont have crosses on our buildings of worship. They ask, Why arent your chapels built in the shape of a cross? and Why dont you encourage your people to wear and display crosses? Even some members wonder about the Churchs policy toward crosses.

We may find part of the answer to these questions in Matthew 16:2425, where we read, Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.

For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it. [Matt. 16:2425]

Over the centuries, in the minds of millions of people, the cross has been recognized as a symbol of Christianity. But rather than displaying the cross, we prefer to try carrying our crosses.

The Lords message to us is Take up your cross. Take yourself the way you are, and lift yourself in the direction of the better. Regardless of where you have been, what you have done, or what you havent done, trust God. Believe in him. Worship him as you carry your cross with dignity and determination.

As we read in Matthew, we save our lives by losing them for the Lords sake. As we lose ourselves, we will find God. That is his promise, and I declare that it is true."

http://www.lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?vgnextoid=2354fccf2b7db010VgnVCM1000004d82620aRCRD&locale=0&sourceId=86d8d7630a27b010VgnVCM1000004d82620a____&hideNav=1

Cocobeem · Keeper of the Holy Grail

Huh. I'm into symbols I guess, cuz I still don't find those answers completely satisfactory. I have two symbols on my keychain... a widow's mite coin and a little iron rod. I wouldn't mind finding a nice classy cross necklace (I really like the Celtic stuff, too).

See, I went to Catholic Jr. High school. I really liked it. The teachers were wonderful, everyone was very nice. I was only one of two non-Catholics in my class - the other was a Methodist girl. They patiently answered our questions. Sister Elizabeth was my math teacher and she was a nun. I loved her. I wanted to be a nun. Can you see me as a NUN? It almost happened, people. I won a Catholic school art contest drawing the crucifixion. I guess I just like crosses.

Valhalla · Profuse Pontificator

Coco, no offense intended, but I have a very difficult time picturing you as a nun! wink

So yeah, based on what I read, I think it is really a cultural thing for Mormons. Kind of like don't drink Coke, or that is my pew, or blue shirts are the debil, or Harry Potter has magic and magic is an imitation of the priesthood therefore Harry Potter is evil!

-- Edited by Valhalla at 14:35, 2008-05-22

Cocobeem · Keeper of the Holy Grail

One extreme or the other... I went with the other.

Just a JOKE, people! Sheesh! rolleyes