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Bountiful -> LDS Discussions -> The secret may be out, and no more home teaching?
Post Info TOPIC: The secret may be out, and no more home teaching?
Valhalla


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The secret may be out, and no more home teaching?
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A court order the Church to reveal its finances, the Church is arguing it is unconstitutional, in a suit by a guy claiming his home teacher molested him.

Ore. court rules against church's bid to keep finances secret

7/12/2007, 12:35 a.m. PDT
Link to article
The Associated Press		  

PORTLAND, Ore. (AP) The Oregon Supreme Court rejected an effort by the Mormon church to withhold financial information from the lawyers for a man who claims a "home teacher" frequently molested him about 20 years ago.

Despite the legal defeat, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints did not immediately release the detailed financial information about its net worth, The Oregonian newspaper reported.

Kelly Clark, an attorney for the Oregon man suing the church, said it would be good for a jury to have the information before considering his request for $45 million in punitive damages. A trial is scheduled for Aug. 6.

 


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"A jury needs to know the entire financial context to know whether a punitive award is too much or sufficient or not enough," Clark said.

The LDS church sought emergency relief from a trial court order to turn over the financial information, but the Oregon Supreme Court late Monday rejected the appeal. The pretrial decision was reached on narrow pretrial grounds and doesn't mean the court would not ultimately side with the church's position that the Constitution protects its right to keep financial information private.

"The church is considering its position," Stephen F. English, the LDS church's lead Portland attorney, told the newspaper. "The church respects the rule of law but has profound constitutional concerns based on its constitutional right to protect the free expression of its religion."

The LDS church has not released financial information since 1959.

"It's the secret of secrets," said Timothy N. Kosnoff, a Seattle attorney who sought the information in 2001 on behalf of a former Oregon man who claimed he was sexually abused by an LDS Sunday school teacher.

Kosnoff never got the information because the church agreed to pay his client $3 million.

The latest bid to expose the church's net worth stems from a lawsuit filed last year that accuses Kenneth I. Johnson Jr. of molesting a Beaverton youth as often as twice a week in the late 1980s.

Johnson, who has denied the accusation, was the boy's home teacher, a church-sanctioned lay official authorized to provide educational and religious guidance, according to the suit.

English said Johnson was acting as a family friend, not a church official, and LDS church officials did not know about the alleged abuse while it was happening.



-- Edited by arbilad at 15:18, 2007-07-12

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Lo, there I see my mother, my sisters, my brothers
Lo, there I see the line of my people back to the beginning
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Cat Herder


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Here I thought it was going to be an announcement that we didn't have to home teach anymore...

I could see this one going all the way to the US Supreme Court for the Church to get satisfaction and protection from these sort of unreasonable attacks.

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rayb


Hot Air Balloon

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Very sad. It's hard to suggest that the church be held liable for the actions of a single hometeacher. Wow.

This whole affair will be a nightmare to define in legal terms, because the church organization is so different from traditional church organizations in which the clergy is paid.

--Ray


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Cocobeem


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I think if the Church ever has to reveal what it's really worth -- we're all gonna' be like jawdrop.gif

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arbilad


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Sorry Val, I gave in to temptation and shortened the url in the article. It was driving me nuts scrolling back and forth to read people's posts.
I see no reason for the church to reveal their finances. Nothing has even been proven yet concerning this allegation. This guy just wants the jury to have the "They're rich, they can afford it" reaction. But it's not like the church is a public corporation that has to report their net worth quarterly. They're a private organization, and they shouldn't have to reveal their finances just because this scumbag wants to go after a rich target.
True, the church has a huge net worth. But it's not like that's all in coins and dollar bills in a money bin somewhere. Most of it is invested in buildings, facilities, and things that actually do people some good.

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If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!
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Valhalla


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I agree, Ray. It is sad to hold an entire organization accountable, especially regarding a volunteer service, this is not like it happened in a church building or a church leader. From the article it appears only to a be a civil suit. The antis have been wanting to get their hands on this info for a long time.

There was a time article about 10-12 years ago that estimated at that time that the church was worth about $30 billion and took in about $4.5 billion a year.

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Lo, there I see my mother, my sisters, my brothers
Lo, there I see the line of my people back to the beginning
Lo, they call to me, they bid me take my place among them
In the halls of Valhalla, where the brave may live...forever
Cocobeem


Keeper of the Holy Grail

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I betcha' eventually the Church will have to reveal this. Don't you think that would be a great score for Satan? I think he's working on it. Maybe there'll be some lawsuit somewhere... maybe it will be a long-time elaborate set-up, even, who knows? Maybe we'll lose our tax-exempt status... Maybe the constitution will be "set aside" as the North American Union takes hold... but hey! At least there won't be borders to hinder the missionary work! (Yeah, what missionary work?)

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Roper


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Val, I think I remember that article, or one like it.  I remember it stating that the LDS church was the second richest in the world, next to the Catholic Church.  And that the Catholic church was still #1 mainly because of the value of property owned around the world.  But over the last 10 years, we've built a whole lot of temples and chapels. 

So yeah, we're a target for this kinda stuff just like the Catholic church is.  How many millions have they paid out in similar claims?

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Organist


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If they reveal the information they should just reveal the ward or stake financial information.

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Cat Herder


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Now that would be rich... the guy and his lawyer could end up with the jury deciding that any award would amount to about $9.95! rofl.gif

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rayb


Hot Air Balloon

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How about just revealing the Elder's Quorum's budget. :)

--Ray

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Organist


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Have you heard any updates? It has been several months, and I haven't heard what the church's net worth is.

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Janey


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I haven't seen any stories on the topic. Since this ruling came down before there was even a trial to determine whether or not the abuse actually occurred, I imagine the delay is expected. After all, if the lawyer wants the info to determine punitive damages, then it makes sense to wait until they've actually established liability. You don't need to start counting up punitive damages before you've even shown that you ought to get any money.

Keep an eye on this blog: Messenger and Advocate He posts updates on Church litigation, along with some decent analysis.

His latest post about a Church sexual abuse lawsuit is at the blog but it doesn't talk about the order to disclose financial info.

And I give up.  How do you name a link something besides the entire url?  Is there a button in the advanced editor I haven't found yet?  Do I have to write out the html code myself?

-- Edited by Janey at 18:03, 2007-11-19

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arbilad


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Janey, it's rocket science. First, you select the text that you want to make into a link. Then, you click on the chainlink icon that highlights when text is highlighted. In the resulting window, enter the url you want to link to, then choose "open in a new window", then click insert. So, for example, if I wanted to link to an article on kilts, I would first type the word "kilt", then I would highlight the text, then I would click on the chain icon, enter the url http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kilt, choose "open in a new window", then click insert. The link turns blue when you're successful.

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If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!
- Samuel Adams
Cat Herder


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I just had to say I forgot about this discussion until I looked at the thread. My first thought at seeing the thread title was "Oh what a wicked and perverse generation are we that the Lord has had to remove Hometeaching... We can't even keep this lesser law..."

Then I realized "HEY! I'm talking about me!" and was thankfully grateful to find out I was wrong when I read the thread again, glad that I still had time to repent and become a better hometeacher...

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It seems to me the only thing you've learned is that Caesar is a "salad dressing dude."
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